Please enjoy the beauty of nature while I explain how it came to be that the book will first be published in Spanish before it will be published in English, and then please enjoy reading the interviews with some of the fascinating people I interviewed in Mexico.  I have been fortunate to learn a great deal fromjust being curious, asking questions and having fun.

I finished writing the book in March of 2007 but was too busy to sell my book to publishers.  Maria Bustos, (a motivated and fun woman I had supervised in the Post Graduate Program at the Georgetown Family Center for three plus years) called to say she had talked to a publisher, Heberto Ruz, who really liked the book and had read it in one week. 

You can see there was no master plan. This project just emerged from people talking about possibilities.  Mario Bustos had talked to Francisco Gonzalez, the general director of USEM http://www.usem.org.mx/ and he brought in Heberto Ruz.

I am deeply grateful for all those who were interviewed and to their family and friends for  Overall it takes real courage to tell your story. It takes courage to be open and not overly restrained about what has been important in how we adapt to the twists and turns that life offers. 
Life offers lessons to us all and hopefully we can learn a few of them from interesting others.

Below are the interview from Francesco Piazzesi, Mario Buzzolini, Victor Lichtinguer, Don Lorenzo Servitje,  Ernesto Valenzuela, Fernando Manzanilla, 

 

Francesco Piazzesi

 

AMS- I am so pleased to meet you after all I have heard about you. I congratulate you on receiving a medal from President Felipe De Jesus Calderon this past Monday for your company ADOBE HOME AID and its work with sustainable housing. 

 

FP – Thank you.  How would you like to organize this interview? 

 

AMS- Often I just ask people to tell me about their passion and what they wanted to do and then we find out how the family fits into their life story.  How did you find your passion?

 

FP –Let me start with one step behind. I started in a family business. I worked in a family business. (ITAL Mexican). We make construction equipment and we produce the big gray blocks.

 

I always had a bug inside to help the people in the community. Perhaps this is due to my romanticism or perhaps because life has brought me a lot of opportunities.   I ask my students, why are you here instead of in Africa?  Why – there must be a higher reason?  It is more than luck.  There must be a higher reason not to be born and die at three years of age. It is not just luck

 

Carlos Slim is not just lucky.  So why are we here? That is the question.

 

I always try to help people.  I like to get into something that can help people.

That has always been there since I was a student.

 

AMS -Where are you in your family of origin? 

 

FP – I have an older half sister.  She is the daughter of my mother. My mother became a widow in Italy during the war. Then she married my father. The oldest of my brothers, Paolo, was born in Italy and three others were born in Mexico. One brother died of leukemia at 20 or so, 30 years ago or something like that.  I was 16 at the time.  Then there was Mario and then I was born.  I am the baby of the family. 

 

AMS- We call the younger one, the charming one. Often the parents are beguiled by that child. The youngest have a special ability to bring people into harmony. 

 

I thought, as you were talking, about the role of tragedy in a family in forging loyalty and caring for others. Who knows, perhaps the value of looking out for others might help avoid future tragedy?

 

FP- In college there was an organization to help people bring water to those who were without fresh water for drinking. I thought, let’s go there. People would say what are you doing there?

 

After that I worked in the family business. Then in 1985 I said, we need a construction method to help the poorest people build a house. So we looked around and found all this fantastic technology. It was great, except for the price. Then we found some equipment to make this fantastic adobe. But it did not go to the poor families. The well off wanted it for the most expensive homes with swimming pools.  We had worked to make the construction equipment for this adobe material available at a low cost, but the poorer people did not want it.  The well off people wanted it for their beautiful homes.  It was funny.

 

The poor people wanted to have the cement block.  Adobe was for poor people they said. I could not control these people.  I could say two things 1) you have to pay and 2) you have to work to have a home. “No,” they would just tell me, “My congressman said I would get it for free.”  I would say, “Bring him here and talk to him here.  We have enough money for ten houses and you have to pay so another ten families can have homes. You have to pay and work to make that possible.”

 

This was fantastic. Here was my passion: to see how the people work with the equipment and thereby transform. It is amazing how these families transform. 

 

We come to the community and they were in these cardboard houses. We stayed with the families for a couple of days.  Then we found that the people who work and take the stress while building the new house change. We went back to see how both they and the houses are doing.

 

The family [Andrea:  it’s the same family who’s moved into an improved house, right?] of the cardboard house and the new house are completely different. We did this from 1985 to 1997.  Its like you took the family of the old house and you put them in a rocket to Juniper and a new family returns.

 

Two hurricanes occurred in Chiapas and wiped out many peoples lives and homes. During Hurricane Pauline, ten thousand people lost their homes in one night.

 

We were working with the government to rebuild. A Gift for Peace was one of the organizations which helped enable the building of these homes. We did this cautiously with an exchange program.  “You bring your guns and we will give you the help to build your homes.” [Not sure what guns have to do with it.  Will the readers?]

 

We were there when the hurricane struck.

 

 

These people lost their cardboard houses in one night. We worked with the government in a program to rebuild.  I knew we would be able to bring them the opportunity to build their home.  We worked and built 40,000 homes that the families also helped build.

 

We bring the actors and the materials together. The actors have specific expertise in home building: technology, financial, NGO’s and the local and national government agencies.  

 

We did not manage the money, we asked for the needed supplies. We would say we need 10,000 pounds of concrete, and it was there.  We asked for ten trucks and they were there.

 

AMS – What a difference from Katrina.

 

FP – Yes everyone helped. The World Bank and Habitat for Humanity were all involved.  We did his from 1997 to December of last year.  Everything was done as philanthropy.

 

Five years ago I said we have made possible the largest self built housing development in the world. How can we do Chiapas again?  We tried to put together a model to explain what we had done. We actually did not know how it happened. The angels helped us for sure. 

 

We tried to help the poorer people and found that our models would work for ten or so houses but then something went wrong.  But we could not make it happen for larger numbers of homes.

 

I tried to figure out the model in my free time but realistically I had no time to attend to it. I would go to the office, and the phone would ring and I saw it could not happen in this way.

 

Therefore I decided that going back to the university was the only way to work on this model and devote enough time to make it happen. I asked the dean at my university about doing a Ph.D. in this area. It would be focused on how to make a community sustainable through the self build housing market.

 

The Dean said let me check with the faculty. Finally, after we fought a little he said OK, you can start. And then it took me five years to put together all these areas of knowledge.

 

I had to learn about micro credit and apply it to housing.  I learned all this at the university and changed the PhD to sustaible housing microfinance.  Then we worked with NGOs. They said you can work in these areas.  This work resulted in the award that president Caldron gave me this past Sunday.

 

The angels are still around here. The phone rings and the national commission of housing wants me to do this and that. They have heard about our work and want us to go here and there. So now all the parts are coming together.

 

A government trust would say, “We have the funds for 5,000 houses, start building.  We have head about your program and we are deeply interested in this.”

 

 It is fantastic. In a way it’s like a miracle.

 

AMS – You observed and saw this happen and knew that you had to put all the details out clearly. And that took you five years to get your PhD.  You have still stuck with your original thesis.  The people have to work and participate and everyone gets to profit.

 

 

FP- Yes it’s a win-win situation. We say that the families and community must work together with the other partners.  All those involved must profit from the arrangement so it can be a win-win situation.

 

AMS-I will go back to you family situation and consider how your family leaving Italy and immigrating to another country might also have also impressed on you how families need to work together to make difficult things possible.

 

FP – I am thinking about what you are saying.   My father was the only son and was about to inherit not a large fortune, but he was to inherit everything and be well off.

 

Something that you said is picking on my mind now. 

 

My uncles and his friends said “Mario, why go to the university as you are going to inherit a fortune and you do not have to work.

 

My dad said, “I like engineering and building roads.”  So he went to the University of Piazza.

 

Then the war came along and he lost everything. He said he came to this country with $7.00 and a suit.  This was not exactly true. They had something left after the war. 

 

My mother was a widow of the first husband.  The first husband was a marine captain. Now it was war time, and his ship was attacked.  All the marines died during this attack. That was the end, so she was alone with little Rosanna. Fortunately she met my father and they married. 

 

Her family lived near where the Italian marble was mined. Some of her uncles had gone to Mexico to sell marble.  One of her uncles said come here. Mexico is very peaceful, and there are lots of opportunities, the people are very nice. My father said well, I have to go there.

 

My father had been in jail for 3 years after the war.  He had been like a regional governor. In Italy he had this position of being in charge of many regional counties. He was a public servant that they took and put in jail.   He had done nothing wrong. My mother said what are you doing?  What is the evidence?  She fought for his release during those years. My mother showed that there was nothing wrong with the work he had been doing, and secured his release. 

 

AMS – Your mother also fights for what is right.

 

FP – My father was very disappointed in his government.  This was in 1949.  My father said my government did not support me. So I will see what is going on in Mexico.  My father came here and then wrote to my mother and said, I do not know what you are going to do but I am going to stay here in Mexico.  My father was very nice and charming and a good taste for art and was a very knowledgeable guy.

 

AMS – Your Dad was also ready to change.  He also set his wife free.  He seemed very mature in setting people free, even his wife was free to decide.  You follow this principle you are setting people free to make up their own mind if they want to build a home or not. People are free to choose.

 

FP – Yes, as you can see my mother was a very tough woman. To my father money was something; it was like a glass of wine. My mother was careful; she took care of every cent. 

 

AMS- They were opposites that were attracted.

 

FP – My father worked for the state building roads in Tabasco.  It was a jungle.  My father said I saw some equipment in Italy that produced block and so he ordered this equipment. He could see it was a good business and so he began the family business and my mother took care of the money.

 

I can see there is a link between the generations. I can see that money is a link. It is not the reason I am here for money. But money deserves respect. 

 

AMS- You were going to circle back to Carlos Slim?

 

FP- One day my friend told me, you are going to be seated next to Don Lorenzo. He will ask, tell me a bit about who you are and what you do.

 

So I made a special block for the occasion.  Talking about equipment would not be anything.  After all he makes equipment to make bread all around the world. So when he asked me what do I do I said I make equipment to make block and I showed him a block that has BIMBO on it.  I told him about the project.  This was before I had the PhD. I said I need the money for this project for the people.  Then he said he would help with all but the money.  He gave me the contacts, the networking to produce the housing for the poor.

 

Then Don Lorenzo called one day. It was shocking.  Especially to my brother who thought I was teasing.  But we talked about the project.  What is the issue here, he asked?  Financing, I said.  He said you can not hold out your hand saying give me, give me forever. No, you need sustainable financing.  Let me think about it.  He called later to say “Come to Carlos Slim’s house.” 

 

When I came he said, Hello Francisco, how is the sustainable market?  Don Lornezo told me about your project. What kind of market are we talking about?  I said, well, we are talking 5 million families, 25 million people, and $5,000 for each house to be built so we are talking about 30 billion dollars.   In how many years do you want to do this? He asked me.  In ten years, I replied. “No”, he said, “you need to do it in 5 years.”  So he said to my student Tony, ”Put together the company that can do this work with cement, and all the other things necessary and let’s see what you can work out.” 

 

 

We got together in a second meeting. I said, we are going to the community and motivate them to get out of the cardboard house and they have to do things. It will not be all us doing it. 

 

Two days later Don Lorenzo called me.    I said, first we need the will of the people, and then we can get the money.  Then I went back to Don Lorenzo and he said to me.  Ten thousand here is fantastic but it’s not going to work unless you can build millions of houses. How are you going to solve the problem in Mexico, not in just one community? 

 

Building millions of houses requires 40 billion dollars.It’s just too much money.  The government will say we have so many other problems. People are living in the cardboard houses and so I can do nothing more for them.  So I saw that all the players had to be motivated to change and work together. 

 

AMS – It did not come as a vision to you in one moment, it was part of a dialogue with others. Do you have a drawing of your model?

 

I am going to go back to your mother and father for a moment.  The drawing puts the details of the plan together in a picture that is easy to understand.  I would say the logical left brain is a bit like the logic of doing the tasks like your Mom did.  You’re Dad

might have been good at the big picture, the right brain side. He was more of a big picture person and your Mom provided more of the logical details needed in planning.

 

FP- You always have to figure out how to bring the actors together.   

The people need solutions: they need the bankers, the technology to make a better world, but they need money.  Bankers need clients.  The NGOs need the community. They work with the government and the people. Everyone has to have a reason to work together. All of them need the other partners. Then the structure can work for everyone.   

 

AMS – A family will produce emergent leaders.  In this community perhaps you see the most viable leaders emerge? 

 

FP – Yes, we see that this happens. We do not have to fight to see who arises.  Someone says, we have to talk.   

 

AMS – In a big group often you can see that 10 % will lead, 70% will go along and 20% oppose.

 

FP- I think more oppose.

 

AMS – How do you deal with the resistance?

 

FP – If you do not want to come along, do not worry.  We switched the tone. If you do not want to work there is not a problem.  We will only be here for those who want to work.  We only need one.  

 

Most of the time the leader was a woman, as the female sees the house as a place where the children will be raised. The male thinks only about how much the house will cost. The female says this is my home, I will work for it.

 

The leader of the first community said,  “My home, not my house, is worth gold”.

 

AMS – What I hear in your values is that this is each person’s free decision to make.  If you do not want to do it that is OK.  But to give the people freedom to choose and take responsibility is a key.  This is a key to unlock incredible resources.

 

FP – Yes, even my family was wondering if this was good thing. They thought I was wasting my time.  Even my PhD was a waste, as I could be doing more work for the company. 

 

AMS – Also your story fits into the framework for the Mindful Compass: See what needs to be done to deal with resistance, using your knowledge, and be willing to stand alone.

 

FP – I knew I needed to get my PhD in micro economics.  I phoned my university where I had been teaching social responsibility and began to work on developing this model.  I have had 25 years of teaching social responsibilities. I want to promote great minds that are willing to do something.

 

Draft of the model: It is a six sided model with feedback loops between all parties.

 

Communities ————————————–Government

 

NGOs————————————————Financial system

 

 Entrepreneurs———————————–Technology

 

AMS – What are your favorite books?

 

FP – My favorite books are history. I love the book about Anita Roddick, the head of The Body Shop. Anita died last Sept. (23 October 1942 – 10 September 2007)  She was willing to help the people and pay fairly for their work. 

 

I admire people who do something for the community and for society.   Some students say “Well we are not lerning about Robert Murdoch. That is because he is not doing

something worth while for society.  If you are here thinking you want to make a lot of money then you are in the wrong course.  You are here to learn how to learn and learn to be a better person.  Then you can make more money.

 

AMS – How long have you been teaching?

 

FP- I have been teaching for 25 years. I started with one math teacher who said, you can teach. He made me his assistant, then he died. He was 70 something. But he died in the middle of the course.  So the university told me you need to finish the course.  The first time I tought I was timid. But after that I said if I could live by teaching I would,

but you can not live by teaching.

 

AMS – You have such chrisma and enthusiasm, what a fabulous teacher you are.

I hope your class can be seen instead of the soap operas. You are far better than the actors on the soaps. It would be great fun if you were available for people on the web. It would be much more inspiring. 

 

FP- I love Mother Theresa but there is something missing there.  There are many rich men and who cares.  Its good to find people that you admire to learn from.

 

AMS -How about your family.

 

FP – I have been married for 35 years. I have three daughters.

One girl, Alexandra, is going to finsh architecture school.  I named Rafelia in memory of my brother.  She has all the family mentally kidnapped.  She thinks a lot and comes up with something incredible to say to the family.  Franchesca, the little one, is the happiness of the house. 

 

Victoria, my wife, is a very religious person.  She finds Don Lorenzo at church every morning. She says he sends you his regards and wonders where you were. 

 

There is another thing I am not sure how to make sense of.   I was kidnapped.

I was beaten terribly. I was left with a lot of pain and had to see many doctors.

 

The first question was why this terrible thing happened to me. But then after time I understood it was not wise to ask this question.

 

The Dr said “Try not to do sports because of your back. Have a very relaxed

Life”. Then I said “So then do I commit suicide?”  I started to work on myself.

I lerned to ski with the family again, not every year but a bit at a time.  And I did it. 

 

AMS- You said this also about your family of origin.  There was also not a reason for those tragedies.  Your mother’s first husband died, your br’other died. 

 

If you see life as a process then something else will arise. We are not frozen in the past.

 

By naming your daughter after your brother you signal that this is not a tragedy.

Your brothers life energy will go on.  He will continue to be an inspiration in the family. 

 

FP – I am glad you put this in as it makes our life more human.

 

AMS – We all have challenges and if we can overcome them and still be as charming as you are, it is an inspiration to others. 

 

Thank you-

 

Mindful Compass Points

 

(1)  The ability to define a vision:   Clearly Francesco Piazzesi has a deep commitment to enabling others to do well. He has also thought a great deal about  where this urge to be useful to others comes from. Obviously not a majority of people are as inspired to make a difference as he is.  “I always had a bug inside to help the people in the community. Perhaps this is due to my romanticism or perhaps because life has brought me a lot of opportunities.”   Over the years he found ways to contribute, yet his biggest contribution took the longest to bring to life.  Initially he was in the right place at the right time with more of an unstructured idea than with a detailed plan. It took him five years of effort to get his PhD and see the plan brought fully to life. The details of any vision are often the sticking point, and the difference between great success and failure.  In making his vision a reality he had to answer the following questions:

 

(1) What are the rewards for going in this or that direction? 

(2) Who will oppose me, and for what reasons?

(3) Where can I build alliances? 

(4) What are the incentives to each participant for making these changes?

 

Much of accomplishing his vision required that he be in dialogue with others and be able to navigate the social relationship system with comfort.   I suggested that due to his being a youngest he would have greater self assurance, all things being equal, than other sibling positions. I also suggested that due to the tragedies in his family of origin he had a stronger instinct to be helpful to others who were less fortunate.

 

Francesco Piazzesi is a rare individual who could see a need and be able to understand how to motivate others to build a system which can operate in different areas of the world.  The system he developed provided not only housing, but opportunity for incredible changes in the fabric of the social system itself.

 

(2) The resistance to change in self and in any system:  All systems will resist change. It is not personal.  It is part of the adaptive response to the new.  Francesco Piazzesi describes beautifully the back and forth with his family over his business ideas and his returning to school to get his PhD. We can see that even if it was difficult for him to manage the criticism he could sense that the others wanted his energy more for the family business than as a criticism of him.   Again in conversations with the top business leaders he was able to hear their preferences, as one way to go and then sort out what path would be the most useful. He seems to have had little negative reactivity to the opinions of others. His sense of humor is always communicated in these meetings and reduces the tension. 

 

Early on when his brother died he asked the why question for which there is no real answer.  And then again after being kidnapped he starts to ask this question and realizes that will take him down a useless road and comes to put his energy into moving forward with his physical rehabilitation rather than lingering over the past whys.

 

 

 

 

(3)The ability to connect and use systems knowledge: Francesco Piazzesi has an automatic, internal guidance system, or compass, which enabled him to know what to do in social situations.  His basic intuition and instinct, based on his experiences, also incorporates his analytical thinking.  Therefore he considers the ideas about the link between his family dynamics and his interest in social responsibilities. We can watch as he puts these pieces together in a meaningful linked map about how family values arise.

In this way he is building his more Mindful Compass.

 

 

(4)The ability to be separate: In listening to his story I could sense his ability to separate out while listening to others’ ideas.  Because he is very adept at being social and describes his interactions well with others it may take a moment to see how adroitly he allows others to be free, leaving himself alone to await their decision. The story of how his father did this with his mother is a key insight into this process of setting the others free and at the same time making them responsible for their decisions.  It takes time for anyone to organize their life stories into more meaning-filled connections but in this interview I could see it happening in real time. At another level when he was kidnapped there would have to have a deeply courageous ability to be totally alone to come out without bitterness from a tormenting situation.

 

Both of these events are testimony to the need to strengthen our ability to be alone to both think for ourselves and manage the encounters with others without letting the others determine who we are.

 

In addition Francesco Piazzesi has investigated knowledge from other disciplines and read widely. During his life he has picked out people to learn from. Obviously being in the area of social responsibility has involved being alone to consider the deep emotional nature of problems.

 

Today, complex problems threatening our environment may be the biggest stress-makers we humans face. There is no consensus about who must do what, and who will bear the costs of so doing. When there are no simple answers, the group gets anxious, and it becomes more crucial to find leaders who can stand alone and enable people to come together to solve problems by taking needed action for our long term survival.

 

Appreciation for the Interviews

 

First, I would like to deeply thank the very kind and generous individuals who were willing to be interviewed. 

 

Each had the intention that others might benefit from their experience. 

Each was aware that acquiring meaning from life’s challenges requires reflection. 

 

Of course all of us would benefit from re-understanding what has influenced the twists and turns of life, but to do so we must risk misunderstandings (with the interviewer, the audience, the self) in the attempt to be reflective and open.  Therefore, being open is for the few and the brave. 

 

Being open is the only way to calibrate one’s Mindful Compass.  Being more objective about our past is learning, and it is a self defining process. Here we are expanding knowledge and building useful strategies for continuing to be thoughtful individuals in complex, emotional, living systems.

 

We know that our social relationships affect habits and values, and are grateful to those individuals willing to tell us how they develop in relationships.

 

Interview with Don Lorenzo Servitje

 

I had the great honor of interviewing the founder of Grupo Bimbo, Don Lorenzo Servitje. At 89 his mind is alive with ideas. His ability to express himself I found almost poetic. Two things stood out in the interview: one, a deep appreciation for strong values and,  a fundamental understanding of the importance of past relationships on the future.

 

(The assumption is that those willing to learn from the past will have more complex thought process.  It may be that is that brain connections are influenced by family connections. That is the greater the connections between people, the greater the behavioral flexibility.  Flexible people are also less likely to be blinded by emotional reactions. Some have suggested that understanding your families past, without judgment, is likely to reduce one’s level of anxiety.) 

 

Talk about complexity, his company was established in Mexico City in 1945 and over time, Grupo Bimbo, has become one of the three largest bakeries in the world in terms of production and sales volume.  They supply over one million points of sales in eighteen different countries, requiring them to deliver products daily to an outlet or a factory. The distant equivalent to traveling around the globe about 46 times a day. The company is committed to high productivity and responsible community projects such as reforestation. They reported sales of $5.9 billion dollars in 2006.  They have 76 plants and operate three trading agencies. (As an exercise think of what it would require of you to see and lead successfully in a system of this complexity.)

 

As I understand it, Don Lorenzo Servitje also helped found the society for entrepreneurs, USEM.  USEM organizes web seminars, distant learning and various kinds of meetings bringing new ideas to business people.  http://www.usem.org.mx/  It was through this organization and its director, Francisco Gonzalez, that I was invited to interview Don Lorenzo Servitje.

 

 

My first question was: How did your family encourage him to be a leader?

                                                                                                           

Don Lorenzo Servitje said that he was not sure if his family thought he would be a good leader but that his mother had a very high opinion of him. Her ideas were based on some facts, as he was usually second or third in his class in school.  He noted, that “I was not afraid to talk with people and I was able to perform well. My mother was my main interest as my father died when I was 18.”

 

I asked Don Lorenzo Servitje, “Are you the oldest son in your family?”  He noted that, “I had an older brother but he died when I was four years old and then I became the oldest son. I also had a sister who was three years younger and two younger brothers. One was ten years younger and the other eleven years younger.  They were like sons to me, in a way.  Years later, one of them said I was like his father. The death of my father in 1936 forced me to go ahead.  My mother and I had worked in the pastry shop with my father.  Now, it was up to us to support the family. We were in the pastry business for nine years.  I saved money.  Then together with a friend, and a cousin, we formed the industrial business of Bimbo.”

 

I was interested in how much he had learned by running a small business, the pastry shop with his father. I told him that my son-in-law, Michael Mauboussin, (More Than You Know: Finding Financial Wisdom in Unconventional Places) had explained business dynamics to me back in 1991. Michael helped me understand my family business by talking about how to capitalize and run a small lemonade stand. For example, I had never considered that a business had to continue to earn over the cost of capital for things the business owned clear and free, like the land the stand was on.  Nor had I put enough energy into the ways one had to save to keep the stand looking good and to expand dynamically. 

 

I asked Don Lorenzo Servitje if he had a vision of the future when he made the decision to invest in Bimbo. He said that he and his colleagues had developed experience between 1940 and 1945 supplying companies throughout South America.  That experience, coupled with people who trusted him and planned with him, was the launching pad for the industrial baking business, Bimbo.  He explained: ”We took our savings and borrowed an equal amount of money to make this happen.  It has grown over the years.  During this period my mother remained as an owner of the company.  Then she remarried at the age of 63.”   

 

Don Lorenzo Servitje continued: “I was 26 when I married. We had eight children. There were six girls in a row and then two sons. The youngest son is an original thinker.  He has a special gift for business. He went to Stanford and was the first in his class. He is far better than I am.”

 

I told him that we all hope that our children will do better than we do. If our children do better perhaps we have done something right.  In essence part of collecting family stories is to encourage other people to do well by understanding how real people have become successful leaders and overcome hardships. It is encouraging for others to know that successful individuals have overcome difficulties like the early loss of a father.

 

We talked a bit about how the early loss of a father is a common theme in American politics today. Bill Clinton and Barack Obama grew up without their fathers’ influence. It would seem that both men want to be better fathers, both in their families and for their country.

 

(In my book I highlight that some of us are leaders by default we had to rise up and lead when difficult things happen. Others are natural leaders who rise up without trauma or serious losses.  One way is not necessarily superior to another. I developed The Mindful Compass to point out that leaders are those who have a vision and are willing to act with knowledge, even if they have to act alone. Leaders have the courage to overcome challenges. If they are mindful of their impact on others and can also enable others to become leaders then they are mature leaders.)

 

 

I noted that Don Lorenzo Servitje also seems to have become the father for his siblings, family and company and perhaps for the people of Mexico.

 

Don Lorenzo Servitje then said, “I am too old.  I am 89. I lost my wife six years ago. Carmen was 80. She left me without advice.”

 

I said “Perhaps that is a gift.  It could be.  Suppose she told you to marry again?” I said. And he replied:  “I am faithful. She was a very wise woman and a very sweet woman.  I have suffered many times because of the business. But I was a workaholic. She held everything together.  She was a very typical housewife. She loved to be at home with the children. She was the queen of the house. I had no problems with the children or the home. She was a very responsible woman and I suffer in her absence.”

 

I was not sure that his wife Carmen would like it if he were suffering.  I was sure I did not want him to suffer any more than necessary so I said, “I would like it if her memory made you happy.”  He thought for a moment and said “Her loss is a very sweet pain.”

 

 

I asked him what he would say to the young people in Mexico that they might carry in their hearts as important principles.   He said:  “One, keep your faith, be good Christians.

Two, work hard and be wary of distractions and a frivolous life.   Three, learning is important.  I love to read lots of books.  My life has been study and work.  I am a very plain man.” 

 

I noted that perhaps a simple man can see the simple truth. 

 

Don Lorenzo Servitje said, “I see what I think is right and I keep on going.”

 

“Were your parent’s family religious?” I asked.

 

“My mother’s family was more religious than my father’s family.  I know my extended family. I have pictures and stories as I researched my family back to 1770. They were mostly working in the fields.  They were peasants.”

 

“What made you do family research?” I asked.

 

“I was traveling to Spain often. My family was from Spain and as a hobby I looked for the origins of my family in the records of the Churches. I learned many curious things about the family.”

 

I noted that in my years as a family therapist I had found that healthier and stronger people just automatically were more interested in family history and knew more about their family roots. These people are often more accepting of different kinds of people as they see all the variations possible in four or five generations in a family. 

 

Don Lorenzo Servitje said “I talked with my children about their ancestors. Also I took my children to Spain to see where the ancestors lived. I also showed them where I lived when I was a young boy.”

 

It is not easy to go visit the homes of your very distant relatives. I told him about my visit to Ireland and how I had felt uneasy in a town where several generations ago the family I am related to had a fight between the older and younger brother. When I was in the town of the younger brother’s family I became ill. When I was in the older brother’s home town I was fine.  Was I sensitive to a fight that occurred over a hundred and fifty years ago?  Perhaps by going back to these two places I was more able to accept my own sensitivities.  It takes time to understand and respect the difficulties people have lived with over the generations.  

 

Then Don Lorenzo Servitje showed me some photos from his family research.

 

“Here you can see a picture in 1976, and then seventeen years later the same group of children has grown up. This is the place I was born in 1924. This is the house of my father.  This is the wedding invitation of my mother. My brother was very handsome. Here is a picture of my brother and me and here is one of myself and my sister in the house where we grew up. Here is a picture 50 years later.

 

My sister died before my wife. My other brother died after my father. Yes, I lost two brothers and my sister, the youngest one died two years ago. Such is life.

 

Here is a picture of my wife when we were young. One of my granddaughters is a painter. Here you see a picture of a grandchild and then you can see into the past and there is my wife.”  I said, “Your granddaughter is an artist who paints dramatically the connections between people.  Some might say its all in the genes.”  I did not have time to elaborate on this thought but I did think she must understand the family emotional process at a deep level where the past is folded into the future. The past does not determine the future but it influences and reminds us of our connections to others.  

 

My interview with Servitje concluded when he had to leave for a meeting. 

I said, “Yes, people still need you. I appreciate so much the time for this interview and meeting you in your home. I think this interview will demonstrate the importance of family for a life well lived.”

 

Don Lorenzo Servitje’s Mindful Compass Points

 

(1)  The ability to define a vision: Don Lorenzo Servitje allows us to see how his vision for a larger company arose out of his experiences with his family’s smaller pastry business.  It was not that he started with this vision.  It happened as part of his personal growth with others.  When he had an opportunity to expand into the industrial arena he had also built a trustworthy team which he kept with him over the years.

 

The early death of his brother and then his father were pivotal events. They are high stress events for everyone.  Most difficult for families is dealing with and adapting to the loss of the primary wage earner. It is a threat for most families. Many people have found their lives torn asunder following the loss of a father.  The fact that his family could keep going and did so well testifies to the resiliency in the larger family system.  In his case the loss may have forced him to make responsible decisions at an early age. His decisions to work in the family pastry shop were made as much to support his family as they were to build his career.

 

Obvious Don Lorenzo Servitje became the leader of his family, and business yet he gives a great deal of credit for success to his mother, his other business partners and to his son in the next generation. His wife was in the middle of it all and was a very wise woman who was his responsible partner in life.  Although he misses her mightily he keeps contributing to society in many unknown ways. It seems in his nature to play down the work he does and to build up others.

 

Caring about others is a very deep value that also resonates with his religious values.  Therefore we hear consistent values which are being converted into actions. There is little interest in finding love and approval but more in getting any job done well.

 

Don Lorenzo Servitje is a leader with instinct. He seems to know just what the best action to take is, and then he just does it. His common sense attitudes lead him to spend time and energy investigating the past generations of family members.  This is an unusual action for a person to take in our society.  It is the sign of a leader who can look way beyond the short term. Here is a leader who knows that if something is important then he must find the way to do and have fun in the process.  He discovers his family roots and shares this knowledge with his children, taking them to Spain to see where past generations of the family lived and walking in their footsteps. 

 

It is easy to see how he can inspire others in his work settings and also in his family. He seems to deeply enjoy his work.  He also gives his Christian religion a great deal of credit for all he does and hopes that future generations will also keep true to these time tested values.

 

Mature leaders look beyond charisma to find sustaining principles and values promoting courage and steadfastness in their lives. Don Lorenzo Servitje leads by example. 

 

(2) The resistance to change in self and in any system: Overcoming obstacles is not something that Don Lorenzo Servitje focused on. We know that he overcame the early loss of his father without bitterness or longing. His attitude of just doing what needs to be done, despite the difficulty, gives us a glimpse of man who chooses to do his work without focusing on the difficulties. He seems to be a contented man who is at ease with himself and with all kinds of other people.  Any obstacles are overcome without making them into a big deal. I could see this in his ability to change his attitude about the loss of his wife. He was able to focus on her positive qualities and to let go of the sadness saying, “Her loss is a very sweet pain.”

 

 

(3)The ability to connect and use systems knowledge: Few people have shown the ability to build a successful family and business network as complex as that of Don Lorenzo Servitje.  *(I wondered how much his business ability was influenced by his ability to deeply understand his multigenerational family.)

 

Apparently from an early age Don Lorenzo Servitje was able to perform and be at ease with people. He recognized the importance of his family relationships on his ability to function well.  He was clear that his mother’s ability to see him in a positive light was significant for him. There is no way of knowing exactly what enabled him to understand the importance of the family history. 

 

We can call it intuition or common sense to understand that the past has an impact on the future.  Many people indulge in short term thinking about the family believing that only this generation is important.  People move away from those they consider difficult people or hard to reach family members.  In the business world this tendency to cut off from the problem people in the family could convert to a tendency to walk away from difficult decisions, or to refuse to deal with difficult people, or with difficult jobs.

 

(4)The ability to be separate: Although Don Lorenzo Servitje did not talk about the usefulness of being alone to think, plan and take time to reflect on deeper values, obviously he has done so.  Nothing tests people’s ability to stand alone more than loss. Even if one overcomes the sadness due to loss once, it does not mean that people will be able to do so in the future. 

 

There are many reasons people find to carry on after the loss of a spouse.  With eight children, many grandchildren and great grandchildren, the love and fun of his family life is displayed thought his home.  Clearly the quality of the relationships surrounding him is a major factor in his well functioning life. Another factor is that he loves his work and other projects. 

 

Don Lorenzo Servitje has lived to see many of his closes family members die and has found the needed reasons be a resource to the remaining family members. Some people might have become more sensitive to loss with age.  But here is a man who has the ability, the resiliency to deal gracefully with loss. 

 

Those who have been able to deal with the loss of loved ones have had to learn to stand alone.  Although some may call this an assumption, I suggest that the ability to stand alone is increased when one has dealt well with the death of a loved one.

 

Don Lorenzo Servitje has had to deal with the death of family members from the time he was a young man, obviously he has done so in many ways which have transformed the losses into reasons for carrying on and honoring those who have gone before.

 

                                    *****************************

 

My interview with, Mario Buzzolini, a telecommunications leader in Mexico, continues the tradition of learning for self and allowing others to listen and apply these stories to their own experiences. 

I was again struck with how long it takes for people to understand about the pressure on people in their own family and how useful this kind of understanding is in a seeing how deeply our values are rooted. What are the forces that encourage leaders to take risks and in which thoughtful actions are rooted?

In the book, Leadership Can be Taught, Sharon Daloz Parks takes readers into the classroom of Harvard leadership maven, Ronald Heifetz.  Heifetz uses the students’ own experiences in solving problems people face in the workplace.  He defines leadership as the capacity to mobilize people to respond to challenges and suggests that the bottom line for leaders is the capacity to foster collective.

Ronald Heifetz notes the key factor that makes or breaks leaders notes is, the quality of one’s capacity to be fully present, comprehend what is happening, hold steady in the field of action and make choices about when and how to intervene from within the social group. 

The case study method is an inductive way of analyzing concepts that may apply across multiple contexts. John Dewey and other educators have argued that adults learn best from their experiences. I think this interview follow in this tradition.

  *****************************************

 

 

Mario Buzzolini –

 

 

MB -We have been in the business of producing telecom equipment for 12 years now.

 

AMS- What made you decide to be an entrepreneur? 

 

MB- I studied computer systems at the university then went to work for IBM for a year. I wanted to have my own business, like my father and my grandmother. 

Both of them learned to stand alone to accomplish things.

 

It is amazing when you realize that 50% of the population of Mexico lives in poverty.

This is one of the main reasons I thought that the telecom business would be useful to the Mexican people because it would bring communication methods to the distant parts of Mexico. This is one way to alter the future for the poor people in Mexico.

 

 

AMS – And so first you went to work for a big company?

 

MB –Yes, I wanted to do it more like my father and grandmother had.  But I knew I had to learn how the others had done it since I had no money, no contacts.  So I started learning from others. At first I wondered how companies could be so efficient being so big. You had to ask the manager of your manager and so on before anything could be done. But it was here that I started making contacts and seeing what part of the industry I wanted to work in.  I knew that a big company was not for me in the long run.  I found my interest was in telecommunications and decided to start a small company to make the equipment. 

 

AMS- You started a small company like a CISCO?

 

MB- Well, yes in away, my company is a telecom company. First, I wanted to create a different kind of company. I wanted to have the people who worked there be as passionate about what we did as I was.  I tried to create a culture of loyalty and put the emphasis on making a big investment in the customer.  I wanted the best people, people who wanted to be successful by doing a great job. We all have to have a passion for our work.  

 

 

AMS – I think you are the first person to tell me that their grandmother influenced them.

Are there are two people in your family who are good examples of leaders who did something very unusual?

 

MB- My father and grandmother were each wonderful examples of a leader who could learn from others.

 

My grandparents were political refugees during the Italian civil war. My grandfather had poor health.  There were 6 children to take care of, so my grandmother, who had come from Barcelona, was a housewife with no occupation, had to go to work.  She decided to sell life insurance door to door.  She and her sons built one of the largest insurance brokerage agencies in Mexico. 

 

My grandmother was a very strong and unusual woman. She worked until she was very old.  When her time was over she stopped working, went to the hospital and died.

 

AMS – I would like to be like that too.

 

 

AMS – I am not sure what you might know about how your grandfather influenced his wife?  Often the husbands and wives teach each other about business.  We see that in the Clintons’ run for the presidency in the United States now.

 

MB – I am not sure how but probably they did influence each other.

 

AMS- How many siblings did your grandparents have?

 

MB -. My mother was the 4^th, and the first girl. There were three sons and three daughters.

 

AMS – Did you grow up close to your grandmother? 

 

MB – Yes, I am the first grandson and so I was close to my grandmother. 

 

AMS – You were the favorite but I imagine you got some pressure with the love.

 

MB – Yes, pressure to do well.

 

AMS – Tell me about your mom and your grandmother’s relationship.

 

MB – I could not tell who my grandmother’s favorite was.  They all seem to love and have respect for each other.

 

AMS – Did the youngest have the best position?

 

MB – He now is running the biggest insurance brokerage business in Mexico.

 

AMS –That is interesting a reversal of what one might expect.   Often the oldest would be a traditionalist and continue to work in the family business.  But you, an oldest, branched out into a new business, while the youngest in the generation above you, stayed in the family business. 

 

MB – To me the most important thing is that you love what you do.

 

AMS – Yes, and it was partially your family which had that values enabling choice. 

Therefore that gave you the freedom to do what you wanted to do.

 

How do you think your father influenced you?

 

 

MB – My father was a builder, an architect. He had his own business. He started it before he finished the university. With the exception of 2 or 3 years, he didn’t work for anyone else.  My father did try to get me to work for him, and I did for a brief period of time.   I decided that this was not my real passion.

 

One of my brother’s is a designer and the other one is in the illustration business.

 

AMS – Your family seems to value diversity. That is another marker for a higher level of maturity.

 

MB – I am sure my father wished I would work for him but then he gave me a lot of support. Perhaps in the beginning it was hard for him.

 

AMS – This is another marker for a leader. One who is willing to take a risk, (break into new territory) and stand alone to go in his or her direction.

 

MB – In the beginning it was very hard. We started from nothing and once in a while I would think perhaps I should go back and work with my father.

 

AMS – How long did it take for you to know you were successful.

 

MB – By the end of the first year we had good contracts and things started to take off very fast. The telecom business is something new in Mexico.  Just to start in the networks and telecommunication business we had a big, open market and not much competition.  We were in the right place at the right time.  Telecom is a very complicated business and things change very fast.  You have to say on top of things.

 

AMS – Are you married now?

 

MB – No, I am still single.

 

AMS – Do you think you made a decision to postpone marriage because your business needed you?

 

MB – Possibly.

 

AMS – Bill Gates had that problem too. Eventually he found the right person and I am sure you will too.  Do you have sisters?

 

MB – No, only brothers.

 

AMS – Do you find it easier to work with men rather than woman?

 

MB – No I like to work with woman. I focus on what they know. 

 

AMS – My first husband had no sisters and found that woman were mysterious.

 

MB – In Mexico we are very paternalistic and many men do not like to work with woman.

 

AMS – Women working has created a tremendous upheaval in society. Today woman have far fewer children. This is a very different era from that of our grandparents. 

Being a leader means you also have to adapt well to changes in society. 

What do you consider to be the biggest problem facing Mexico today?

 

MB – The biggest problem in Mexico is the inequality in wealth. Over 50% of people in Mexico live in poverty.  The richest man in the world lives and works in Mexico.

 

AMS – What would you say to Carlos Slim if you could have a conversation with him?

I wonder about this because I think that there are two main ways that people change.

One, is the influence one person has on another. Warren Buffet and Bill Gates are good examples of how people influence one another. 

 

The other is, you change the rules and that changes society in some unknown ways.

 

MB – I think you have to change the rules and that will change the people.

 

I know Carlos Slim and Bill Gates are very generous. They are very good business people but it’s not enough.  We have to change the rules.  They are not mercenaries but it’s not enough. Clearly, we have to change the rules.

 

AMS – One example happened in Ireland. They had high unemployment and low savings rates.  So they decided to give people 20% on their money if they would keep it in the bank for five years. 60% of people decided to do it. This altered how the people behaved and now they have low unemployment and an increase in intellectual capital.

 

I have also wondered how come Mexico is not growing like China.  The Chinese changed the rules.

 

MB – Yes, they have a capitalistic economy and a communist government.

 

AMS- What rules are you going to change?

 

MB – I don’t know how to promote the redistribution of wealth.  It is very complicated but you have to alter the whole system, its rules and how it’s organized in order to make it possible for people to do better. 

 

It will take more time to know what the best solution will be.  But I do think we can sell new ideas and make new rules. People have to know what to do in their own space.  People have to think global and act global.

 

AMS- How has your family experience enabled you to think this way?

 

MB –My grandfather came from Italy to look for a fortune and he thought he was coming to America/Mexico.  He may have been confused about which country he was coming to but he made a success. My grandmother came from Barcelona. They all had to leave and find a new way after the war.

 

AMS – So you do not want to wait for a dictator to force changes in society? Sometimes people have to wait for the society to collapse before change can occur.  But you do not seem to want to wait for a new Mussolini to arise.

 

Do you know much about your great grandparents?

 

MB –No, because of the war many records were lost. After the war I didn’t know about my family in Italy and Spain.

 

AMS – Do you think because some of your family and their stories were lost, you have

a greater desire to make better family stories for the future?

 

MB – Yes, I have a great interest in understanding my family.

 

AMS – You also seem to have a great interest in problem solving. 

 

I was also wondering about your thinking about being strategic in building your business.  How do you deal with people in your company and your customers?  Do you think about how to deal with people, or do you just do it at a gut level.

 

MD-   We have a joke in our office.  It is more important to know who than to know how.

 

Relationships are basic in your business. Your contacts are with humans and you have to have good relationships with other humans you are working with.

 

AMS – I will throw you a trick question. What do you do about people who are tricky and may be seeking power and money and are trying to fool people?

 

MB- I do not like those people.

 

AMS – I have heard that nice guys do not get ahead but you do not believe that?

 

MB- Our philosophy is to take care of people very well.  Our strategy is to have good relationships with others. It is an important part of our business. Our plan is to cultivate trustworthy relationship with our customers. You can not do that without good people working in your business.

 

AMS – How do you tell if people are having a good relationship with others?

 

MB- We have rules inside the company to make sure people are doing well by their customers.

 

AMS – You are looking for people who understand your philosophy.

 

MB- We hire good people.  The people who don’t believe in the importance of being in good relationships with other people leave.

 

AMS – Also you seem to set up an environment for leadership. You empower others to be leaders.

 

MB- I think you have to be a visionary, set up a philosophy and rules and work as a team. Then success will follow.

 

AMS – Did you play sports? And do you think sports helps people to learn how a team functions?

 

MB- Yes, I played soccer for 5 or 6 years and now I do extreme sports. I have a go cart and I like sky diving. 

 

AMS – I am interested in what else, besides your family, may have influenced your leadership style?  What books do you read?

 

MB- I read novels and mysteries. My favorites are The Art of War
by Sun Tzu and The Prince by Niccolo Machiavelli

 

AMS – If only George Bush had read this book. As I recall it he said “only invade a country if you want to live there.”

 

MB- I also like books on Mexican history. I just read one on the civil war in Spain. It helped me understand my grandfather. I began to understand more of what he had been through. Before that I thought he was neurotic.

 

AMS – That’s a great example of one way to compensate when your family has lost its stories of the past.  Some people would just write off the family members who are difficult. It is not at all easy to take the time to understand the history that shaped the person who is hard to deal with.

 

MB- I had an opportunity to meet many of my cousins this week, and told them about the book.  They bought the book and also say now they see he was not neurotic. 

 

AMS – Even though the person has died, your relationship with them can change as you know more about them and the situation they were in. People are forced into difficult situations that then alters their life.  It’s not just their personality.

 

I had a similar situation with my father being misunderstood in the family.  It took me a long time to stand up for my Dad in my family. His brother, my uncle, was mad at my father who drank after the war and just focused on that as his legacy.  I talked to my uncle about my father, and his mission in the war.  He was an intelligence officer, flying a B29 over Japan and planning the fire bombing of the civilian population.  This time in the service may have kept his children from becoming Japanese, but it cost him in terms of his personal life.  I said to my uncle, my dad went to war for you. You had flat feet, so you could not go to war. My uncle saw me differently after that.  I did not just go along with the way he saw my father and I used factual knowledge to alter the way the family saw him.

 

Knowledge can change families but it has to lived out in someone will take actions with others in the family. 

 

MB- I am very curious about what you are doing. I can see how your family and your background influenced your situation today and tomorrow.

 

I never stopped to think about this and this is a very good opportunity.

 

I really like this exercise to understand your own situation at strategic times. You are you because of your circumstances. 

AMS – I see our time is up. Thank you very much.

Now you are my brother.

 

MB- And you are my sister. 

Mario Buzzolini Mindful Compass Points

 

(1)  The ability to define a vision:   Mario Buzzolini has found his passion in the telecom industry.  His vision satisfied two deep needs. One is to help the people of Mexico. His business makes it possible for poor people to have access to modern technology.  Two, he tell us he wants to do it more like my father and grandmother had done.

They were independent people.

 

His vision was to have his own business and he was willing to pay the price to learn from others successful people.  Spending time being an apprentice seems to be a part of a formula for anyone who hopes to become an expert.  One of his big questions that formed a backbone principle for him was to wonder: how could companies be so efficient being so big?  You have to ask the manager of your manager and so on before anything can be done.

 

Another theme we have heard from others is that there is not much ego involvement here as he notes, I was in the right place at the right time.

 

As an oldest and the oldest grandson he had many opportunities to take care of his younger siblings but I did not have time to ask the question if these experiences were instrumental in his being focused on talking care of his customers and his employees.

 

As with other people I have interviewed there were serious challenges that had to be overcome. His grandparents were caught up in the Spanish Civil war and immigrated as they saw more hope in a new land.  Often families who escape from difficult circumstances have strong reason to care for others. He has a business mind and found a business reason to care about others, the customer first. 

In understanding how to motivate others and build a successful business, he puts himself as an important part of how his business will function. Dr. Bowen use to say it this way: “If I see a problem then I know I am somehow apart of it and a part of the solution.”

 

Although Mario Buzzolini has a vision of how his country could change he doesn’t know which rules to change.  He believes  that people at the local level might know more about what to do to improve their lives. 

 

(2) The resistance to change in self and in any system:  The main story of resistance to change was the self doubt that he had about starting his business in the first year.  At times he thought perhaps he should go back and work for his father.   But he stood firm and found his original ideas were planted in firm ground.   Now he has a  substantial business. 

 

The second example concerned his relationship with his grandfather.  I am not sure if his grandfather was alive when Mario Buzzolini  read a book that shed more light on who his grandfather was.  Mario Buzzolini had thought of his grandfather as a neurotic man but after reading and understanding the social forces his grandfather was up against,  he saw him in a new light.  He was then able to tell others in the family, who also may have had a negative impression about their grandfather. Many were able to reorganize the relationship with their grandfather, even if it was only in their minds.

 

Altering relationships based on factual knowledge and standing up to old negative ways of thinking about others usually is difficult to do. Emotional systems can be very stuck in “blaming” others for all of the so called problems.  His family seems to be able to move beyond the blaming dynamic and to see how systems operate. 

 

By overcoming resistance Mario Buzzolini continues to be able to build his business and strengthen family and alliance within his work force.

 

 

(3)The ability to connect and use systems knowledge: At the end of the interview Mario Buzzolini remarks on how this interview has been a very good exercise. I am very curious about what you are doing. I can see how your family and your background influenced your situation today and tomorrow. I never stopped to think about this and this is a very good opportunity. I really like this exercise to understand your own situation at strategic times. You are you because of your circumstances. 

 

It is not that easy for people to see how talking about family history and their values impacting on your life leads to system thinking, but he makes the leap easily.

 

Some of this may be due to his reading of history which often gives people a fundamental understanding of the many factors in social and economic change. It may also be that due to his large and complex family he can synthesize information well.  But all of this is speculation as to why  he has the ability to use and understand system ideas.

 

(4)The ability to be separate:  If anyone is to start their own business it seems obvious that the individual will need to strengthen the ability to think for self.  Mario Buzzolini had the central insight that a successful business would have to be people centered.  His ability to pick good people and to enable them to understand his philosophy is evidence of how well he understands this process in his relationship with others.  He also is interested in considering the deep emotional nature of problems for the people of Mexico.

All of this has to be work that one does in his or her head before attempting to communicate it to others.

 

Considering actions need to be taken now so that the future will be better, is the kind of work that is high risk and has no promise of reward.  Perhaps this is one more reason to participate in extreme sports.  They are a physical way to warm up for the mental challenges one encounters in the risk and rewards of thinking systems. Once again Mario is alone and making an effort to anticipate and prepare well for the future.

 

                                                ********************

VICTOR LICHTINGER

 

AMS- I met you in 2004 and you made an impression on me as a very open man who was a long-term thinker. I also found you were a youngest in your family of origin which is an interesting position for a leader. The youngest has a different view of the family. They often take a non-traditional approach.  Sometimes the youngest is the prince, sometimes they bring joy to the family and sometimes they do not think that the family is all that important.  

 

I wanted to interview you when we met but it’s taken this long for it to happen.  I have had good contact over these years with your wife, Mely. I am grateful to her for organizing the time for the interview.  Mely has been very helpful to Maria Bustos, who brought me to Mexico, and her work with the Endometriosis Society.

 

I am interested in your perception of the relationship forces that shaped you as a leader.

 

VL- We will start with the family. I am the youngest of 4 brothers. You are entirely right; I was the prince of the family. I was protected by my parents. The education I received was much more flexible than the one my brothers received. My parents were more mature and wiser and knew how to deal with things. They had all ready dealt with everything from my 3 brothers. So I am much freer than my brothers and more liberal in terms of believing that freedom and choice are the most important things that you can have.

 

My family was very happy, and both of my parents were very intelligent. My father was a doctor, very clear thinking and principled. He is respected as a doctor and as a human being.  He saw his patients as human beings, not as objects. When he retired I was shocked when I went to other doctors (he was my doctor when I was young) and they were so different.

 

My father is now 86 and he lives in another area.  Even thought I am somewhat famous as a politician, many people know me more as the son of my father.  When we meet they ask if I am the son of Dr. Lichtinger. I am very happy with that.

 

Perhaps you have forgotten as you also come from a partially immigrant family. But it is more important for the first generation to do well.

 

AMS- You also come from an immigrant family, when did your family come to Mexico.

 

VL- My father came in 1929.   He was born in 1921 and his family left Poland due to economic and political discrimination.  His family thought Mexico was still part of the Americas and so it was easy to come here first. They immediately come to Mexico City.

 

My grandfather was a salesman who went from town to town selling everything. He came to Latin America three or four years before my father and grandmother came. He liked it and saved his money and brought his family here.

 

My father was an incredible inspiration to me. He was an only child and very close to his mother.

 

My mother is a fanatic for knowledge. She studied to be a teacher after high school.  She was born in Mexico and was also from a Polish Mexican family. She was always unsatisfied as she wanted to know more.  When I started to go to kindergarten she started to study and now has earned two PhD’s in literature and philosophy. 

.

At 9:00 to 9:30 at night she would read us classical novels, and fun books,  Shakespeare and Don Quixote. She read us the story of the boy who travels thorough time. She wanted us to be open minded. She wanted us to be cultured and knowledgeable and have many points of view.

 

I was so lucky to have these incredible parents. We would take these great trips in this big Buick and we would be fighting and shouting as we traveled along.

 

 I also learned a lot from my bothers. I have three great brothers. One is very intelligent and others more human. 

 

AMS – Darwin was right we have to have variation.

 

 VL – I also learned from seeing their lives.  One married very young and not with the right woman. Another studied something he did not like. In that way I was able to learn things from them that also influenced my actions.

 

What else would you like to know?

 

AMS – I was thinking about how your family was capable of long term thinking. Some families that immigrate have a special ability to take a risk and make a better life when they see the conditions changing.  It took three of four years before the rest of your family could follow our grandfather. One of the family values and themes are the ability to take a risk when you see that things are changing.  You knew that you could take a risk and make a better life. 

 

VL – Yes, people who are not satisfied have many choices. There are those that made the choice to stay in the terrible conditions.  Others were willing to take the risk to leave. Some of these people died.  All of the people in my family are risk takers.  We also have self esteem and we know that we can do it.  We have an incredible belief that if we make the sacrifices we know we can be successful.

 

One of the important things about leadership is that you believe in yourself, that you can make a difference. One of the important values is to want to change things to make a difference to improve other peoples’ lives. 

 

My mother became very left. We became left together with my mother.  I was 16 or 17. She was 40. She became very dissatisfied and frustrated with politics. She became left but not the radical left.  She wanted to improve the well being of people and was willing to fight against injustice.  I had that feeling strongly too. Over time I have changed my political opinion about the various parties.

 

AMS- Are you saying your values might be maintained but your strategies change as to how you fit in with the various political parties.

 

VL – I must tell you I feel that I do not fit. 

 

AMS – Is that an advantage?

 

 

VL – It might have to do with my rebelliousness and having ideas and strategies to do what I believe in but not feel that others represent me.

 

I have always felt a bit alone. Because I feel most people are very hypocritical.  I have lived an intense life for over fifty years with very strong values.  When I was in politics and back when I was in school I felt that way.  I still feel that way.

 

So the few people I think who have very deep principles are my best friends.  I have a lot of people who know me but very few friends.  I pick them very well.

 

I have never joined a party.  That is a mixture of feeling strongly that I don’t fit with a mixture of strategy as well.

 

 I feel that most parties here lost their good intentions and objectives. They have lost their way. They have become out of focus for what they need to do.  They want power for power’s sake. Then when they arrive and have power they become very corrupt.

 

AMS -  I am thinking about wht you are saying in terms of the mindful compass that I developed.  You have hit on all the major points for being mindful of your direction within an emotional system composed of human beings. 

 

Family systems theory has nine concepts to use to understand families. I thought it was too many to communicate to the general public.  My daughter challenged me to reduce it to two concepts. I figured I could do it in four points. The last point was the capacity to be alone. People tell me that I should change this point on the compass because being alone as a needed state for a leader will not sell.

 

 

VL – Having power is being alone. You can be wrong in your decisions but they are yours.  People are always telling you one thing and then another. I feel very good about being alone.  For me it’s kind of like a privilege.

 

I was a popular kid in school but I did not need people and I always looked for ways of being alone. 

 

AMS – Do you mediate? 

 

VL – No I do not in the formal sense. One of my brothers is very knowledgeable in this area.  When you are alone your brain can come up with great ideas.

 

AMS – How do you communicate your ideas into a team if you are alone?

 

VL – I was a water polo player. I was passing the ball and sharing the opportunity and I loved the idea that we were building something.  If you are a team player and you are not sure of your ideas and yourself you can not support your team mates.

 

AMS – They feel your anxiety.

 

VL – Yes, the anxiety and the uncertainty. Also I am a social and extraverted person and I enjoy being with people.

 

AMS – How about school?  When did you decide about school, etc.?

 

VL – I decided that I wanted to go to public college. I was in the small Catholic high school and I felt that they were trying to tell me wht to do and to brain wash me. They told me all the things I did were wrong.

 

I wanted to open up to the world and see all the different kinds of people. I went to a very good school and decided to study economics.

 

My father was worried as I did not like anything but philosophy but I did not want to starve as a philosopher.   So my father started to introduce me to his friends, one of whom was an economist.  He said, “You are listening to engineers, etc., but what the economy is doing is important in each of these areas.  If you are interested in the well being of people then study economics.”

 

My father’s career was not for me. He worked hard and woke up in the middle of the night and was not with his family all that much.

 

I started to study economics. First there were camps and they put you in cages. You are a Marxist  or you are a Keynesian.

 

Keynes said in the long term you are dead. Yes, but I still wanted to know how our action now will influence the future.

 

I did this based on the fact that people change in the long term not in the short term.

 

Realistically, you can only make things slightly different than the way they were before.  For good and bad you make things different in slow steps until you cross some threshold. Then it seems like everything happened in a moment.

 

When it came to the environment, I cared about the long term.  We defend things for the long term and for the all people, not just one person. 

 

After going to Stanford, I went to Africa and tried to help people in Mozambique.  Then I got a chance to work for the UN as an economic counselor. It was 1987 and the environment was just beginning to be seen as important. A lot of things happened then.  The Berlin wall fell. During the cold war things were in an unproductive balance.  After the war a great deal more change was possible. The human rights movement gained momentum for woman, gays and the environment. These were the human rights needed to be granted after the French revolution. (Liberty, Equality, Fraternity).

 

In 1987 I was not knowledgeable about the environment and may have been the least knowledgeable of the people at the UN.

 

A Swedish man, who I took as my guru, developed an interest in me. He said, “I see you are a leader, you are very passionate”.   He was the Swedish Ambassador to Mexico, Ambassador Bo, and he invited me to Sweden.   He also took representatives from Indian, Venezuela and two other countries.  He showed us how the destruction of the environment caused the people to continue to suffer with no way out. We went to Sierra Leon, Rwanda and the Congo. Then in Sweden we looked at theory and how things worked. The prime minister of Norway Gro Harlem Brundtland was also important in my learning.    She was a wonderful woman. (Norwegian Minister for Environmental Affairs 1974-79, and became Norway’s first – and to date only – female Prime Minister February – October 1981)  I also saw Al Gore as a congressman. He was there taking notes. I really respect him and the work he continues to do.

 

This was the first year of discussing the environment.

 

I realized that Mexico was a mess on the environment. I was working in the economic affairs department of the Mexican government. You could not see the buildings in Mexico City due to the air pollution. The gas had lead in it in the late eighties and early nineties.

 

I started to really care and began to work with NGOs to solve these problems.  Because of this work I was picked as the coordinator for the UN Conference on Environment and Development (Rio de Janeiro, 1992).  I had to negotiate with the political people about how to clean rivers and how to keep water safe and the atmosphere as clean as possible.

 

After this work I resigned to form a consulting firm. I had been working for the government for 2 years.  I thought I could do more outside then inside the government.  But it was difficult to form this consulting firm so I joined with an American firm and we began to do some very good work.

 

Then in 1994 I was asked to be the representative from Mexico to work on the NAFTA environmental commission for the US, Canada and Mexico.  I was not appointed by the Mexican government, the commissioners themselves asked for me to be appointed.  I came to Canada and they said to me,  “Here is some money.  Now just make this commission function.”

 

We assembled a great team of fifty people.   One of the important issues was that DDT was still being used until 1997. We found the technology to measure how the isotopes of DDT traveled. We also proved that they were even to be found in the artic regions and that they would persist there for a hundred years.

 

In 1998 the government changed and I had no job.   I knew that the bigger the needed change the bigger the resistance to it. 

 

Again, I went back to consulting. This time it was easier. Mr. Fox was elected and he approached me about becoming the Minister for the Environment.  My wife warned me it would not be easy and that I should not take the job.  But I knew that I might be able to make a difference in this position and so I went in with a lot of optimism.  I thought that President Fox would support my ideas. 

 

The first month there I got rid of lot of people and brought in new people who had never been in the government.  There were 35,000 people in this one agency. My mission was to be honest and hold open meetings for the big group every week. Many had never even seen a minister much less had the chance to hear and see one. 

 

I told them I would hold these big open meetings to give a message of pride, hope and the need for strength. My door would always be open for people to talk with me. For one hour after these big meetings anyone could come and talk to me.  I focused on what do you do with problems and how can I help solve problems. After one year people were clear about what their functions were.

 

However after the first month I went to Fox and asked for his support to bring more cooperation between the different ministries in order to focus on sustainable development. He said, “no,” he was not going to go in that direction. He thought that focusing on job creation alone would be his way of going.

 

After that meeting I wanted to quit but my wife said NO you took the job and now you have to stay with it. 

 

I stayed with the ideas of sustainable development. My goal was to develop and grow without impacting negatively the environment and the people’s long term future.

 

After three years I left and the next president of Mexico, Calderon, took my place as the minister of the environment.  I had the opportunity to reinvent myself.  My three criteria for what I will do are:

1) Passion will lead me to work in areas where I will be successful

2) I must be knowledgeable about what I want to do

3)  I want to have a positive impact on a lot of lives.

 

AMS_ Thank you so much for your time and the energy and for your life focus. I am sure that we will hear interesting things about what you are doing in the not too distant future.

 

VICTOR LICHTINGER’S MINDFUL COMPASS POINTS

 

(1)  The ability to define a vision: Early on in Victor Lichtinger’s life he became aware of the impact of values on others.  He witnessed his father’s life as a humanitarian, and heard his mother passion about helping others.  These experiences plus the plight of his grandparents in leaving a country, where there was a gross lack of human rights, formed the reasons and passions for his future vision.  The deep values of helping improve people’s lives and to enable programs which will sustainable life on our planet arose from his families life experiences and take form in his actions. 

 

I have found that the more people’s vision is grounded in a positive relationship with family values the easier it is to sustain those values during difficult time.  It’s like the values have deep roots.  And we certainly see this in the story of his life. 

 

 

 

 

(2) The resistance to change in self and in any system: The most challenging thing about resistance is its ability to turn people critical about others. This leads to negative and often harmful energy.  It can also promote emotional cutoff from individuals or even groups of people.

 

 One of the things in the story of working for President Fox is how fabulous it was that his wife refused to go along with his initial reaction to the news that his vision would not be supported in the way he had hoped. By listening to his wife and forcing himself to reconsider and to rethink the advantages of staying in his job, he was able to make a large impact on the environmental program and in the department itself.

 

The importance of managing negative reactions to people can not be overstated.  Building a sustainable network came to be a significant factor in building a sustainable economy or a sustainable environment.  It has to be done with look at the future and the ability to be aware of and also to manage ones internal feeling states.

 

(3)The ability to connect and use systems knowledge: One of the interesting things was how his father taught him about the power of networking by example.  His father introduced him to other people in order to allow him to think more carefully about his future profession.

 

Often it’s hard for children to think under direct pressure from a parent. It is far easier to think without the emotional push of important others.

 

By widening the group of resourceful people his father began a trend that would be useful to Victory Lichtinger’s life in the future.  Creating a larger group to learn from has sustained his vision into and out of various enterprises.

 

(4)The ability to be separate:  Once again we can see how crucial the ability to be separate is in determining one’s values. If one deeply believes in their values as Victor Lichtinger does, then it is far easier to deliver a profound and trustable message to people.

 

Victor Lichtinger’s notes: It might have to do with my rebelliousness and having ideas and strategies to do what I believe in but not feel that others represent me.

 

I have always felt a bit alone. Because I fell most people are very hypocritical.  I have lived an intense life for over fifty years with very strong values.  When I was in politics and back when I was in school I felt that way.  I still feel that way.

 

For those who are sensitive to and need love and approval the negative tide of reactions can often not be stemmed.

 

The willingness to go along with the social group is not just a problem for teenagers. The ability to experience being separate and being OK with that gut level feeling of loneliness is crucial to taking responsibility for difficult decision, and for staying in relationship with others when the opposition arises, as it will. 

 

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Ernesto Valenzuela a life partner for Deloitte. His family is from the western part of Mexico and he is a middle sibling.   

 

AMS- Maria has great respect for you and your work and you’re your family over the years.  I think you know she brought me to Mexico to introduce my book to the people at USEM.

 

EV- Yes the USEM is a very good organization.  I know that many of the most important business people take their courses.

 

 AMS- They have been very open to the ideas about how leaders emerge from families and they suggested fabulous people for me to interview.  The publisher, Herberto Ruz, who works with them will publish it in Spanish before it is published in English. 

 

Perhaps the Mexican people are more curious about the importance of families?  Or I need an outgoing person like Maria, who can sell my book to for the English audience. 

 

What kind of work are you now doing?

 

EV- I have been retired from Deloitte, for four years.  [1] In one way I retired but I still am enjoying my work and therefore I am still helping a few of my former clients.  Some of these companies and people I have worked with for thirty years.  We work with all kinds of businesses. 

 

Retired does not mean much of a change for me, as I immediately opened this office for my clients who wanted me to continue with them.

 

AMS- What would be the reason be for you to continue to work?

 

EV- I have a passion. The most important thing to me is that I am helping others. After all my clients are also doing good things and I would like to enable them to be even more successful. I really enjoy this kind of work.

 

AMS- I can understand that as I too am partially retired.  After many years of clinical work I wanted to take the knowledge that I had gained over many years and use it to enable others to show the path to leadership. 

 

People who have been successful leaders are often very good observers and they understand the importance of relationships.   

 

I am curious as to how your family fits with your goals and values. Often when we tell good stories about our experiences, people learn something of what you learned.

 

EV- I put down some ideas, since Maria gave me an overview of your interest.

 

First, I am very happy and comfortable with what I have done in my professional life. I do think God has helped me. 

 

Next, I think a leader is born into it. He or she is developing in his way by what he sees at home, at school and what he sees at work. Leaders grow in the way he or she notices.

 

AMS- So you think a leader is a born observer?

 

EV – Yes, and a leader will be listening more than talking. He or she tries to guide people without imposing on them.  People do not feel that a real leader is someone who is ordering others about.

 

There were 80 people in the firm of Deloitte when I started here. Then by 2004 there were 4,000 people.  This is the growth that has happened in 37 years.

 

For twenty-seven years I have been a board member. No one else in Mexico has done this at such a young age. That’s important to me.

 

I am a financial advisor. People are mainly looking for mature people. They are not interested in just service. People are looking for personal guidance and a plan that is made for them as an individuals.  I have ten clients now and I do not want more people than this. If I grow too much I will lose quality.

 

As to people who influence me, when I was in school I had a teacher who gave me some good advice.  I was studying to be a bookkeeper. He said there was another level, the CPA level, and that I should aim for this goal. I thought about it and knew he was right and that I should go further.

 

I was born in Baja in 1942.[2]  It was 1959 when I finished my high school.  My father took us to Mexico City on the way to Acapulco. Our family is Acapulco lovers. When we stopped here, I greatly admired this city. When my father asked me where I would like to go to college, I said Mexico City. I admired the city then and now it has changed.  I live 30 minutes outside the city at this time. Back then there were only 5 million people living here. There was clean air and it was beautiful.

 

I moved here and I studied from 1960 to 1965.  At that time I was also working.  I studied 2 hours in the morning and 3 hours at night.  There was a good group of Mexican businessmen who had formed a company. I worked there for 5 years.  When I was studying I noticed that there were a lot of Americans doing business with us and so I decided to go get my masters at Georgetown University. 

 

I loved my time at Georgetown. When I was there I met a man from Ernst and Young. I told him I would like to be involved in consulting to more companies rather than working for one company.  He said if I was to join them I would be paid the salary that I was making in my other job.

 

AMS – So you took a risk to join a new company?

 

EV- Yes, and it was a very good experience working there.  In Mexico it was expected that you should write a book as part of your degree.  So I went to the library of congress and wrote my thesis in 3 month.  Finally I became a registered accountant in 1968.

 

AMS – You trusted your mentors and your father trusted you?

 

EV- Yes, my father knew that I loved the city here and both my parents were fine with my decisions.  But here I am now watching the city I love changing for the worse due to smog etc.

 

AMS- Yes, there is a regression through out the world as there is smog in all big cities.

 

EV- To return to the importance of relationships, I am fortunate to have had mentors and a family who believed in me.

 

In 1972 I got married and after that my wife helped me a great deal. My wife is my first passion, then my family, and then my career.  If you have support from your family you do not have a limit to personal growth.

 

I have seen other brilliant people who have not done well as they have problems in their families. Some of these people were my supervisors. I saw their wives did not help them or the family, and so they did not do well. There were lots of divorces.

 

AMS – Perhaps one could say it is like the appearance of smog, as divorce and other problems increase with the increase in the numbers of people.  As the complexity is increasing, the problems are increasing too.

 

I was saying that yesterday at the meeting with the USEM people.  If you have problem in the family, these worries can go with you to work, and if you have problems at work they can go home with you.

 

EV- I could not agree more. In the Mexican branch of my company there are now 300 partners and I have mentored 150 of these people.

 

If anyone of these people call me I never say no, as I always make time to listen and help them sort out things. Yes, I sacrifice a little personal time.   But this is a very important responsibility.  When I retired in 2005 I have been able to take the time to play golf and enjoy time with my wife and son. My daughter has two children and she does not have time to play. I want to devote more time to being with my family.

 

An important decision in my life was when met my wife in 1971 and we were married six month later. 

 

AMS- You found your passion and you took the risk.

Sometimes passion can help you to be successful, if you are good at evaluating risk.

 

EV- I know a lot of people at Deloitte.  There are 20,000 clients more or less, and with each one the issues are that you have to give good quality service. 

 

AMS- Is this value, good service to others, a theme in the lives of your grandparents? Is there an interest in math, engineering service?

 

My father was a civil engineer. He did not like administration. He would rather work in the construction industry. He knows construction. I did not like construction but he loves it and he did a lot important land development.

My brother got involved in this area too.

 

I am the 3^rd one born.  The first one was my sister then my brother then me. After me there were 4 more children, two younger brothers and then my two sisters.

 

AMS – That is a big family.

 

EV- Yes, and my youngest sister introduced me to my wife.

 

AMS – Were they at school together?

 

EV- They were at the university together. We married six month after we meet.

 

AMS- Did your mother approve of a such a quick marriage? 

 

EV- Yes, my mother was worried that I was alone here in Mexico City. Then when my mother met her, she was very happy that I was going to marry her. I had only four girl friends in my life and she was the forth one.  The other ones are still my friends. 

 

 

AMS- Yes, it’s important to keep your friends.  I often tease people and say it’s not good to treat your old friends like beer cans and throw them away.

 

What can you tell me about the kid of example your parents were for you?

 

EV- My mother is there for all of us all and now for forty grandchildren. Being there for people is an important value for me too. My mother’s families were farmers.  Next week she will be 87.

 

Eight years ago my father passed away.  My father’s family were usually were involved in business.  My grandfather was involved in baking tortillas and other foods.  He made the big ones and he also had a small packing company.  This was in the nineteen twenties.

 

AMS – Knowing how to run a small company is very important as here you learn the basics. I did not know the general principles of business so I asked my son-in-law to explain and he did it by looking at how you would run a lemonade stand.

 

EV- I also learned from a seeing how a small business is run as I use to keep the books for my grandfather.  Unfortunately he died young. 

 

AMS- People who have had a family business have had to deal with the emotional side of the organization at home and at work.  Those who do not have the opportunity to see how a small family business operates may not realize how fast relationships at work can easily become intense, just like a family.  There are all kinds of loyalty issues and side taking just like in a family.  In a family business there is often no where to hide form the emotions about the business.

 

EV- I advise many people who have family business. I often have to help people to liquidate the business as the family is conflicted or will be better off to sell.  At times I am like an undertaker for the business. 

 

I also help families organize the business into a new business if that is the way they want to go.

 

AMS – It is funny that you say you were like an undertaker. I think this is a good place to learn as you see the real difficulty people face in transitions.

 

My mentor/ boss at Georgetown University had a family business too. His father was an undertaker and ran the funeral home in a small town, Waverly, Tenn.  They also owned the furniture store there. I think he saw how families operated around a death.

 

The main thing I hear is that you have been helped by many people in your life.

 

EV- Yes, and it comes down to the only real thing I am doing is helping people. I do it in my way. For instance I do not give to people who are begging for money but I do pay the people who work for me very well.

 

AMS- You think it is important to pay well for performance?

 

EV- Yes, I appreciate the sacrifices that people make who are helping me. My secretary is very important to how well I do as is my gardener.

 

AMS- So you believe more in using the carrot more than in using the stick.

 

EV- Yes, I do believe in incentives and in recognizing people for what they avhe done.

 

AMS – I also like to reward people for actions.  I will give street people money but only if they will talk to me. I give a dollar if they will talk about how their family and if family members know where they are.  I did this to get over my fear of street people.

 

EV- Let me go back to beggars, As they are a real problem here in Mexico too.  I give money to private association through associations, as I think they can deal with the problems better than I can.

 

AMS- What do you see as the biggest problem in Mexico that you would like to help solve if you had unlimited recourses?

 

EV- To be honest, poverty we will always have.  The most urgent need here in the city is transportation. We are wasting so many man hours per day in trying to go from one point to another.  It is just not effective and wastes a great deal of energy.  From December to early March we have smog and then we have the rains and with this the winds come and get rid of the smog.

 

But still no matter the time of the year, the traffic is going to delay you and keep you from getting where you need to be and so time, energy and money is being wasted.

 

 

AMS- When we drove here I saw it hear it was a pollution day and people could not drive cars that were over ten years old. There were also police men everywhere checking on the cars.

 

EV- Yes. They are there not just for the traffic but also for the safety of the people. The police are checking to see who is in these cars.

 

This is an important part of the city. It is the center for the financials.  They do not want people coming in here with guns.  And that has been a problem. 

 

AMS – Someone told me there was a 50% unemployment in Mexico.

 

EV -  Let  me show you the problems of the people in Mexico. I can draw this for you.  Here we are in the city and many people are coming here from the southern part of the country where there is a great deal of poverty. 

 

They are coming to Mexico City to find work. If you go into the middle of Mexico you do not find poverty.  Some people from these areas are just travelers not leaving because of poverty. 

 

AMS -So are you thinking about this big picture in looking at the transportation problems in Mexico City?  Are you thinking that if people could work on a big project like transportation, it could help all the people?   

 

When I was in Disney World over Christmas I saw that they have a futuristic monorail. They have build these around airports in the U.S. Could you do something like that here?

 

EV- We do not have the funds put aside for transportation.  People who are working here are going to continue to suffer as there are no plans for transportation. We know where the bottle necks are but we have not developed a comprehensive plan. 

 

AMS – Yesterday, I interviewed Francesco Piazzesi, he has been working on how to solve the housing problems for poor people.  He has developed a model based on how to reward business, governments, non profits and the people in the community to work together to build houses. 

 

 

EV- Yes. I have heard that he is one of the people who has made a big differences. He is doing an amazing job.  We need more of this in the government.

 

We use to have 250 representatives but now because of some reason they have double the numbers of people working and wht is it they are doing?

 

AMS – It seems that the entrepreneurs are more able to solve problems as they are more flexible and can do things quickly.

 

EV- Another issue is that unfortunately we have ten very important business men who run the largest corporations and there is no competition in these areas: TV, radio stations, newspapers, oil companies and the public transportations.

 

As you see we allow monopolies and people are not motivated to resolve this conflict of interest which would occur if there were more competition in business.  This is the way things have been, this is what we have. Many of us are fighting this old way of being.

 

There are foreign investors who would like to invest in our country but they can not because of the monopolies. They have permission to run the companies the way they do and it is set up so that no outsiders can break in.

 

I am not sure how long people have been dealing monopolies but I think for a long time.(Competition laws date back to the Roman Empire) [3]   I think in the U.S. broke up the oil and  steel companies first and then later other monopolies. (Modern competition law begins with the United States legislation of the Sherman Act of 1890 and the Clayton Act of 1914) 

 

EV- We are still waiting for the government to change things.

 

AMS- It is an interesting point to ask under what conditions a government can change. There seems to be a tipping point in all systems where the rules change or people change.

 

I gave the example in Ireland where they found a tipping point when they offered people high interest for keeping their money in the bank.  No one knows which rule you put in will change. Now people in the US are trying to find the tipping point to stabilize the financial markets.

 

This is similar to what I do in listening to family members.

I challenge people to think about what they can do that will be different and might enable them to function more effectively.  They know and I know that change involves risk and uncertainty.

 

Ina family a leader usually arises because of a crisis.  Then one person is far more willing to work on their part of the problem. But its hard to change as each person risks with their own life. This is why we call them leaders.  

 

Some very amazing and interesting things happen when one person is willing to be a leader.

 

EV- In Mexico we have what we hope to be and what we are now.  70% of the people have not been helped. 

 

AMS – We can also look at what happen to China. They had a communist government but seemingly suddenly they decide we will let people have a business with little or no taxes. Rules make a difference but we do not know which ones to change.

 

EV- Competition needs good laws.  We are protecting the people who have already done well.  You have to change and to force the end of monopolies. Right now we are talking about the oil companies. They have been saying they should not be spending money on research.  They use all the money on current expenses. They did not use the money for thinking about how to be successful in the future.  They say there is oil in the deep sea but you have to go to 200 meters but we have not done that. We may run out of oil in the next few years as we have not though about the future.

 

AMS – Just as in families nothing change with out the crisis.  Also consider families do not know about their past as a way to prepare for the future.

 

EV- We will have the crisis.  People think today I have money. I do not need you. Today I do not have to cooperate with others. 

 

AMS – Leaders do arise once in a while to take people into the future. There are not many of these leaders like in the US I would consider Lincoln and Roosevelt as very special leaders in time of crisis.

 

EV- Bill Clinton is respected here as in December of 1994 he supported Mexico with billions of dollars.  George Bush has not done as well by us.

 

AMS- Perhaps George Bush has not done as well by his family as Bill Clinton did?

 

EV- I do not know but I do know that what happens in America will impact Mexico. 

 

AMS- We have talked about many interesting ideas today and I thank you so much for your time. Although we did not go into details about your family, clearly we have talked about the very similar problems and process that happen in one’s family which are also happening at work and in society. 

 

Mindful Compass Points Ernesto Valenzuela

 

(1)  The ability to define a vision: Early on Ernesto Valenzuela knew he was interested in a career that was different from his father’s path.  His father did not react to this difference but encouraged him to find his own path.  Ernesto Valenzuela was then freer to follow his directions about where he would go to school and how he would peruse his career.   He remarked that his mother’s only concern was that he would be lonely living away from his family and she was relieved when he found the right woman to marry. 

 

Being a middle sibling in a large family Ernesto Valenzuela probably grew up, as many middle siblings do, knowing how to relate to a wide variety of people. He is able to listen to others, his father, his mentor, and to see the rewards for going further in school despite the costs in terms of working hard. Working hard and family support have been the two main factors that he see in supporting his successful career. 

 

His career requires him to be a good listener and to enable people to think clearly about a plan to solve problems. Being able to navigate in the social world has come easily to him. His current visions involve continuing helping those who have been in relationships to him.  He has a vision of how to think about and solve problems at the social level and he knows how to build alliances to see that change can happen.

 

 

(2) The resistance to change in self and in any system:  Ernesto Valenzuela talks more about the changes in society than the changes he witnessed in his family system. 

 

Clearly he understands how the status quo is a strong force and that both people and organizations resist change. He humorously calls himself the undertaker when families have to make difficult decisions.  It may be that he uses this kind of humor to deflect anxiety.   Since he is in conversations with the top business leaders he is able to hear their concerns about the future of Mexico and to consider different solutions.

 

 

 

(3)The ability to connect and use systems knowledge: Ernesto Valenzuela

knows what to do to enable people to solve problems. He understands the difficulty within system and has had a very positive experience in learning new ideas. 

 

Both of us enjoyed considering the ideas that there is a link between family system dynamics and his interest in social dynamics. The past within his family has given him a great love and admiration for Mexico.  Ernesto Valenzuela is a spokesman for possible change that will make for interesting differences in society.

 

 

(4)The ability to be separate: Clearly he developed his values of loyalty to family and to his clients and those who work in his organization in his big family.  There was no negativity is his resolutions about the family. Therefore we can assume he was separate enough from problems that every family has to have, to not be negatively impacted by his father’s or grandfather’s deaths. Transitions are not a threat if people can be separate from the systems reactions to change.

 

It takes time for anyone to organize their life stories into direct links between family values and family events.   Ernesto Valenzuela seems to sense the connection between events and the impact of history on the future.

 

Clearly there is a need to strengthen the ability to be alone and think carefully about the future direction of one’s business life and one’s country.

 

 The final question always is what am I am going to do about the problems that I see now?  Retirement has not changed his value of using his life energy effectively to make a significant difference in how the problems are addressed and solved.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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